Wednesday, November 1, 2017

Update on Proposal Using Lots & Call for Vote

Many associated with the United Proposal (see HOPE & HOPE - Update posts) have given an update on a proposal containing more details on how we can move forward in manner open to anyone interested in participating and are proposing to hold a vote on even attempting the effort. The details can be found using the following links:

Proposal Summary

Proposal Update 11/01/17

Proposal on How to Move Forward Using Lots (Full Proposal)


  1. I hereby express publicly my dissent from this proposal, both in process and in content.

    Jared Livesey

  2. Jared Livesey,
    I have responded to your public dissent in the thread here:

  3. This comment has been removed by the author.

  4. It is perhaps too late, but I like this proposal from an anonymous source: "Well, if we trust the casting of lots, then we can just number all the various proposals, including the number 0 which will represent the Lord saying, 'none of these are worth shit; start over.' Then we put the numbers into a box, pray a lot, and pull out a number. Voila! We'd then save the 7 people a lot of headaches." If we trust casting lots as a way for the Lord to tell us His choice, then why can't we just do this - draw lots on all the proposals so far, with an option for the answer that none are OK, and we have to try again?

  5. In September 1834 the Kirtland high council appointed a committee consisting of Joseph Smith, Oliver Cowdery, Sidney Rigdon, and Frederick G. Williams to publish a work "arrange[d from] the items of the doctrine of Jesus Christ." This committee was assigned to draw "from the bible, book of mormon, and the revelations which have been given to the church up to this date." Seven lessons on theology and doctrine were produced from the scriptural teachings of Jesus Christ.

    On 17 August 1835, a general assembly of the church met “for the purpose of Examining a book of commandments and covenants” that had been “compiled and written by” the publication committee. “This Committee having finished said Book according to the instructions given them,” the minutes read, “it was deemed necessary to call the general assembly of the Church to see whether the book be approved or not by the authoroties of the church, that it may, if approved, become a law unto the church, and a rule of faith and practice unto the same.”37
    Though the assembly was convened “by the presidency of the Church,”38
    JS and Frederick G. Williams, a member of the presidency, were in Michigan at the time of the assembly.39
    The responsibility of presenting the book to the conference therefore fell to Oliver Cowdery, a member of both the presidency and the four-man publication committee.40
    Sidney Rigdon, the other presidency member and committee member present, stood and “explained the manner by which they intended to obtain the voice of the assembly for or against said book.”41
    Voting on the book proceeded by quorums and groups, with the leader of each group bearing witness of the truth of the volume before his group voted to accept it. After the voting by quorums, the entire church membership present, both male and female, voted to accept the book as “the doctrine and covenants of their faith.”

    The Guide and Standard must follow the same pattern (by appointed committee). If Jared Livesey will allow the Lord to choose its members by lots, I will lovingly and with confidence nominate Jared Livesey as a candidate for said committee.